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Paul Bellamy
8/11/2008 6:45:26 AM | I was e-mailed this earlier today:
A friend of mine found it online somewhere. I'm trying to track it down and see if I can find any more details, and if there are any more!
All the best,
Paul
Paul Bellamy
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Paul Bellamy
8/12/2008 7:14:47 PM | OK Chaps,
We have a timescale as to when this photo was taken, so let's see if we can use the info the Association holds to work out the date shall we?
'758 was probably one of the Group's aircraft swapped out of the 615th Squadron to the 613th when all the Group's PFF aircraft were concentrated into the 615th Squadron in March 1945.
So, the photo is likely to have been taken in March-April 1945.
'758 looks to be missing the ball turret in the photo, and the strike camera doors seem to be open.
The photo was apparently taken by a C-47 pilot who, flying back to the UK alone tagged along with a lone B-17 heading for home.
So, do the Association or NARA hold a record of '758 coming back battle-damaged and out of formation in that period?
All the best,
Paul
Paul Bellamy
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donaldbyers
8/12/2008 8:29:19 PM | I would say that we would have to get the Mission Reports for that time period. This will show all aircraft which had battle damage during a mission. When I got my copy of 24 Aug 1944 it had each aircraft that had battle damage on a sheet of paper that was outlined like a B-17 and where it received damage. Not sure of another source.
Don
Sgt. Donald C. Byers, 613th Bomb Squadron, Togglier, 42-97344 Carrie B II, KIA 08/24/1944.
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Paul Bellamy
8/13/2008 6:56:25 AM | Thanks for the info Don,
I was thinking about other sources this morning, and I would presume the Control Tower Log would have the landing time of '758 if she came in seperately or diverted to another field.
Graham mentioned at one of the Historical Society meetings that the logs were to be made available on disc. If they are does anyone know who I speak to for copies?
All the best,
Paul
Paul Bellamy
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donaldbyers
8/13/2008 1:25:32 PM | It just so happens I do have where you can get it. It's not from the 401st though I am told there are tower logs and you order the 401st BG CD. This guy mentions squadron histories. I will try and clarify.
Mr. Byers,
The WWII era histories of the 401st Bombardment Group are available on CD. The cost is $30.00. To purchase copies of the unit histories, identify the unit and the format and send your check or money order made payable to
Sgt. Donald C. Byers, 613th Bomb Squadron, Togglier, 42-97344 Carrie B II, KIA 08/24/1944.
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win-win
8/17/2008 1:03:44 PM | Don:
(Off the subject IN-P a bit, but regarding your '401BG histories' post:)
1. AFHRA (16mm) Microfilm: From past inquiries I know the AFHRA microfilm roll A0647 has 612Sq and 613Sq. histories. (I don't know, however, which roll/rolls have the Tower Logs or 614Sq, or 615Sq histories). I presume Vic Maslen's 'histories' were transcriptions of these microfilm records.
2. CDs: I didn't know, but it would be great if true, that AFHRA or someone else has these 5-volumes of 401st histories on CD. My two questions would be:
- - Are the CDs of Vic's transcriptions (very readable) or the AFHRA microfilm frames (not so readable)?
- - Does the CD (or CDs) have the 5-volumes - Tower Logs and all 4-Squadrons?;
3. And finally if the CD you're looking into isn't as thought, how about the 401BG producing such a 5-Vol. 401BG set on CD ('.pdf' format?) for sale, of Vic's transcriptions?
(Related, and maybe actually on-subject (IN-P): There are three AFHRA microfilm rolls (that I know of) relating to A/C serial numbers: A1114 & A1115 titled 'A/C Equip. & MACRS', and A1115 titled A/C Ser. Nos.. The 'catch-22' is that other rolls may have other info on these subjects, too).
Hope to see a post from you about what you find about the CDs, soon.
Win
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donaldbyers
8/18/2008 9:20:22 AM | However long it takes for the CD's to get here and I will post my findings. I ordered the 613th Squadron also so I can see what is on that one and this is the interest of my own any how to see if it just has what I already have or any additional info.
Tks Don
Sgt. Donald C. Byers, 613th Bomb Squadron, Togglier, 42-97344 Carrie B II, KIA 08/24/1944.
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win-win
8/18/2008 10:33:34 AM | Don:
- - Cool. I can't wait, either - the CDs may be a great new resource.
- - By the way, I don't know what other 613Sq. history resources you have, but if you (don't have and) want to peruse the AFHRA microfilm rolls I cited, let me know - be glad to loan them. (The trick is finding a library with a 'reader' that works with 16mm, since most microfilm seems to be 35mm).
- - In the meantime, if you'd like, I can E-mail you my (MS Word format) 'frame index' of rolls' contents (some rolls have such near the end of the roll, but this is more setailed so I can find my own way-back to stuff).
Later,
Win
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Paul Bellamy
8/22/2013 4:17:19 PM | Another shot from the same mission, before "Fast Company" left the formation:
Note she is flying in the lead echelon, with 44-8550 IY-D (PFF) in front and 42-31072 IN-K "Betty J" to the right. That should help no end tying the date up to a formation sheet.
The a/c on the far right is a bit of a mystery.
She's coded IN-M, and it looks like she was previously coded IW-M. Her serial number is from a late Vega block, 44-6x0x or 44-8x0x.
Some things don't add up at the moment though...
We know this photo was taken after March 1st 1945, as 44-8550 wears her later 615BS codes rather than her old IN-Q codes when she was assigned to the 613th.
However, IN-M during March and April 1945 was mostly 43-39125 "Der Grossarschvogel". Obviously NOT a 44-xxx serialled aircraft, and certainly not one previously assigned to another squadron as she was newly-delivered on the 8th March.
On the hi-res version the serial seems to read 44-6508, which should be on IW-A/IN-A "Maiden USA".
All very strange.
Paul
Paul Bellamy
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donaldbyers
8/22/2013 5:49:08 PM | Believe I have two possibilities for the AC on far right but not IW:
44-8708 IY-M 615th
44-8707 IY-M 615th
They don't show being transferred to the 613th BS though. I had marked all the 401st aircraft in "The B-17 Flying Fortress Story". There were no matches for the 44-6x0x combination.
Don
Sgt. Donald C. Byers, 613th Bomb Squadron, Togglier, 42-97344 Carrie B II, KIA 08/24/1944.
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