General Posts #148

{s:TopicNav|May 29, 1944 - Sorau|ForumNew.T1369|ForumNew.T0906|ForumNew.T0889|ForumNew.F01|ForumNew.T0885|ForumNew.T0803|ForumNew.T0005} 
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| '''ahronshapiro''' <br/><br/><div class='poster-info'><img src='/public/Attachments/ForumNew.MainPage/NoAvatar.gif' /></div><br/>9/27/2011 4:00:14 AM 
| Hi,<br/> I'm doing research into the mission of May 29, 1944 - Sorau.<br/> <br/> Would anyone have the Mission Folder for this mission or can otherwise please tell more details about the mission than is available on this site?<br/> <br/> There was a long break in escort for the 40th Combat Wing from Cottbus to the Baltic Sea. I suspect the fighters that were supposed to be escorting that wing somehow ended up escorting yours instead.<br/> <br/> There are some details about the rendezvous at the target that was mentioned in the 361st Fighter Group's Mission Report for that day that I could compare with your Group's bombing times, altitude and flak situation over the target to get a better idea if there was indeed a mistake made among the escorts.<br/> <br/> My uncle was killed in the 40th Wing that day and I am trying to piece together what happened up there for the historical record.<br/> <br/> I appreciate your help.<br/> Thanks,<br/> Ahron Shapiro<br/> <br/> P.S. It would also be very helpful to me to know if your crew interrogations from that day sighted any B-17s from other groups getting shot down and what they saw. <br/><br/><br/> 
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| '''Paul Bellamy''' <br/><br/><div class='poster-info'><img src='/public/Attachments/ForumNew.MainPage/Paul Bellamy.jpg' /></div><br/>9/27/2011 5:35:57 AM 
| Hi Ahron,<br/> <br/> Here's some references to fighter cover from the mission report folder that may be of use:<br/> <br/> <blockquote>Enemy fighters were encountered about five minutes after the target and were in the vicinity of the 94th Wing for about thirty minutes. One FW190 made an attack, but all other fighters attacked the Wing to the right of the 94th or were driven off by friendly escort. Fighter escort was fair to poor.</blockquote><br/> <blockquote>After we had bombed the target, a Focke-Wulf assembly plant at Sorau, southeast of Berlin, we proceeded northerly toward the Baltic Sea, at an altitude of 15,000 feet. Friendly escorting fighters were in the vicinity and were able to engage most of the enemy aircraft we observed, at a distance from our formation.</blockquote><br/> <blockquote>At 1329 hours, in the vicinity of Woldenberg, Germany (my Navigator logged the spot as 5300 N - 1548 E) four (4) ME-410s appeared, flying parallel to our formation and in the same direction, at a speed I estimated at 200 mph.<br/> They were approximately 1500 yards away, flying echeloned to the left and were looking us over.<br/> We had been watching them come up and at first I had thought they were B-17s because of their perfect formation. <br/> At this time there was no friendly escorting fighters around and I expected them to start lobbing rockets into our Group formation.</blockquote><br/> <br/> <img class='ForumMaxImgWidth' src='http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k227/ramc181/29Mmisrep24.jpg' /><br/> <br/> All the best,<br/> Paul <br/><br/>Paul Bellamy<br/> <img class='ForumMaxImgWidth' src='/public/Attachments/ForumNew.MainPage/resource1.png' /><br/> 
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| '''ahronshapiro''' <br/><br/><div class='poster-info'><img src='/public/Attachments/ForumNew.MainPage/NoAvatar.gif' /></div><br/>9/27/2011 7:30:13 PM 
| Thanks Paul for your rapid response, <br/> What you have posted is truly useful information for me.<br/> Can you tell me if the mission folder shed any light on whether the 401st BG's bombers had somehow reached the target earlier than planned or what sort of flak they encountered at the target?<br/> I will be happy to share the 361st FG's entire Mission Report with you for that date if you would like it.<br/> Let me know.<br/> It includes Lt. Spencer's famous encounter that your report described from the perspective of the fighters. <br/> Thanks again,<br/> Ahron <br/><br/><br/> 
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| '''Paul Bellamy''' <br/><br/><div class='poster-info'><img src='/public/Attachments/ForumNew.MainPage/Paul Bellamy.jpg' /></div><br/>9/27/2011 7:56:45 PM 
| Here's a condensed timeline from the lead navigator's log, I've marked any differences from the briefed mission as required:<br/> <br/> 10.50: Fighter rendevous (52 37N, 04 37E, Dutch coast)<br/> 11.26: Quakenbruck, Flak at 3 o'clock<br/> 11.31: Dummer lake, 10 miles N of briefed course. (<i>corrected by next Control Point</i>)<br/> 12.45: IP, 15,000 feet<br/> 12.58: Target, bombs away (<i>1 minute late</i>). Ground rockets and Flak <br/> 13.04: B-17 feathers engine<br/> 13.11: A/C down in flames<br/> 13.15; B-17 down, 6 chutes<br/> 13.19: B-17 down, 5 chutes<br/> 13.30: P-51 gets 4 fighters<br/> 13.32: Control Point #5 (<i>1 minute early</i>)<br/> 13.37: B-17 going down, 4 chutes<br/> 14.12: Control Point #6 (<i>1 minute late</i>)<br/> 14.23: B-17 going down, 5 chutes<br/> 15.12: Fighter rendevous, black & white Flak (54 35N, 10 02E)<br/> 15.22: 351BG plane down<br/> <br/> Paul <br/><br/>Paul Bellamy<br/> <img class='ForumMaxImgWidth' src='/public/Attachments/ForumNew.MainPage/resource1.png' /><br/> 
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| '''ahronshapiro''' <br/><br/><div class='poster-info'><img src='/public/Attachments/ForumNew.MainPage/NoAvatar.gif' /></div><br/>9/30/2011 1:02:55 AM 
| Thank you,<br/> That was really helpful information, once again, which will give me plenty to think about.<br/> My uncle was in the plane referred to at 1319, by the way.<br/> I really appreciate your help,<br/> Ahron <br/><br/><br/> 
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| '''ahronshapiro''' <br/><br/><div class='poster-info'><img src='/public/Attachments/ForumNew.MainPage/NoAvatar.gif' /></div><br/>1/17/2012 8:52:46 AM 
| Hi Paul,<br/> Would you be willing to possibly scan in the Lead Navigator's Flight Plan for this mission in its entirety for me (or take a legible digital photo of it)?<br/> I am trying to determine with some degree of accuracy the positioning of the 401st Bomb Group and the 94th CBW in relation to the 305th Bomb Group and the 40th CBW at certain points in their respective missions on this date. It's evident they had a visual on one another but the distances are hard to pin down. It would really help my research a lot.<br/> If you would prefer to email it to me instead of posting it here, please let me know. I'll PM you with my email address.<br/> Thank you very much,<br/> Ahron Shapiro<br/> <br/> <br/> <blockquote><span class='author'>"Paul Bellamy":</span><br/>Here's a condensed timeline from the lead navigator's log, I've marked any differences from the briefed mission as required:<br/> <br/> 10.50: Fighter rendevous (52 37N, 04 37E, Dutch coast)<br/> 11.26: Quakenbruck, Flak at 3 o'clock<br/> 11.31: Dummer lake, 10 miles N of briefed course. (<i>corrected by next Control Point</i>)<br/> 12.45: IP, 15,000 feet<br/> 12.58: Target, bombs away (<i>1 minute late</i>). Ground rockets and Flak <br/> 13.04: B-17 feathers engine<br/> 13.11: A/C down in flames<br/> 13.15; B-17 down, 6 chutes<br/> 13.19: B-17 down, 5 chutes<br/> 13.30: P-51 gets 4 fighters<br/> 13.32: Control Point #5 (<i>1 minute early</i>)<br/> 13.37: B-17 going down, 4 chutes<br/> 14.12: Control Point #6 (<i>1 minute late</i>)<br/> 14.23: B-17 going down, 5 chutes<br/> 15.12: Fighter rendevous, black & white Flak (54 35N, 10 02E)<br/> 15.22: 351BG plane down<br/> <br/> Paul</blockquote> <br/><br/><br/> 
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